(en) Re: Civil society help

----Original message---

From: "hasmet" <hasmetu@yorku.ca>  To: <wsn@csf.colorado.edu>
Subject: civil society help  Date: Thu, 1 Jun 2000 

Hello all,

Can anyone direct me to some literature on (interpretations of) civil
society? I was wondering if it is possible to mention both right and
leftist perspectives.

Appreciate the assistance.
Hasmet Uluorta
Political Science
York University  // Toronto ON  //  Canada

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Dear Hasmet:


Of course you can mention both right and leftist perspectives of civil
society, and even a  seemingly  _rightist_  one inside a real leftist
frame, as I am going to explain.
 


        1) Let's Marx speaks against it

        2)  ...  But Gramsci bestowed upon the concept



1) Let's Marx speaks against it
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

In  the "Theses on Feurbach"  (1845)  no. X  you will find:

        "The standpoint of the old materialism is civil society;  the 
standpoint
of the new one is human society, or socialized humanity."       (Der
Standpunkt des alten Materialismus ist die "bürgerliche" Gesellschaft;
der Standpunkt des neuen die menschliche Gesellschaft, oder die
vergesellschaftete Menschheit.) 


In the famous Preface of  "A Contribution to the Critique of Political
Economy"  (Zur Kritik der Politischen Ökonomie, 1859)  Marx clarified his
thought:

        ".....    neither legal relations nor political forms could be
comprehended whether by themselves or on the basis of a so-called general
development of the human mind, but that on the contrary they originate in
the material conditions of life, the totality of which Hegel, following the
example of English and French thinkers of the eighteenth century, embraces
within the term "civil society"; that the anatomy of this civil society,
however, has to be sought in political economy."    See, for instance,
Hegel,  "Rechtsphilosohie", § 182 on.
  

                (.....    daß Rechtsverhältnisse wie Staatsformen weder aus 
sich selbst
zu begreifen sind noch aus der sogenannten allgemeinen Entwicklung des
menschlichen Geistes, sondern vielmehr in den materiellen
Lebensverhältnissen wurzeln, deren Gesamtheit Hegel, nach dem Vorgang der
Engländer und Franzosen des 18. Jahrhunderts, unter dem Namen "bürgerliche
Gesellschaft" zusammenfaßt, daß aber die Anatomie der bürgerlichen
Gesellschaft in der politischen Ökonomie zu suchen sei. )    


In the beginning of the  "Grundrisse der Kritik der Politischen Oekonomie"
(1857/1858) Marx clearly despises the concept of civil society as an
irrevocable construction of the  XVIII th century.  Let me translate into
English the Spanish version, as published in the 16th edition of  Siglo
Veintuno, based on Dietz Verlag, 1953   ("Elementos Fundamentales para la
Crítica de la Economía Política", Mexico/Spain/Colombia/Argentina, 1989,
vol. I, pp. 3/4):


        "In this society of free competition each individual appears to be 
free
from natural ties, etc.. which in the precedent historical epochs made of
him an integrated part  of a determinate and circumscribed human
conglomerate.  To the XVIII th century prophets  .....   this individual of
the  XVIII th century   --that is the product, by a certain side, of the
dissolution of the feudal society forms and, by another side, of the new
productive forces, which were developed from the XVI th century--   appears
to them as an ideal whose existence should belong to the past.   Not as a
historical result, but as a starting point of history.  According to the
conception that they had of human nature, the individual appeared as
conformable to nature as put by nature  and not as a product of history
(.....)   

        The more we go back into history, the more the individual appears   
--and
accordingly the individual producer--   as a dependent one and being a part
of a bigger whole.   ......   Only when the XVIII th century arrives, with
the   _civil society_,  the different forms of social connection show
themselves to the individual as a simple means to attain one's private
ends, as an external necessity.   But the age that generates this pont of
view, this idea of an individual that is set apart,  it is just the age
when social relations   (universal ones according this point of view)
have reached the highest grade of development up to the present.    Man is,
in the most literal sense, a   _zoon politikon_, not only a social animal,
but rather an animal that may individualize himself in society.   The
production of an isolated individual, outside from society   --a rare fact
that may happens when a civilized person, one that potentially bears in
himself the powers of society, goes accidentally astray in a savage place--
   it is not less absurd than the idea of a development of language without
individuals who live  _together_   and speak among themselves.   It is no
more necessary to dwell on these matters.   It would not be necessary to
touch this point if such a foolish thing, that made sense and had a reason
among the XVIII th century people, was not introduced seriously in the
modern economy  by  Bastiat, Carey, Proudhon, etc." 


                 ("En esta sociedad de libre competencia cada individuo 
aparece como
desprendido de los lazos naturales, etc., que en las épocas históricas
precedentes hacen de él una parte integrante de un conglomerado humano
determinado y circunscrito.  A los profetas del siglo XVIII    .....  este
individuo del siglo XVIII   --que es el producto, por un lado, de la
disolución de las formas de sociedad feudales y, por el otro, de las nuevas
fuerzas productivas, desarrolladas a partir del siglo XVI -- se les aparece
como un ideal cuya existencia habría pertenecido al pasado.  No como
resultado histórico, sino como punto de partida de la historia.  Según la
concepción que tenían de la naturaleza humana, el individuo aparecía como
conforme a la naturaleza  en cuanto puesto por la naturaleza y no en cuanto
producto de la historia.   (.....)

                Cuanto más lejos nos remontamos en la historia, tanto más 
aparece el
individuo    --y por conseguiente también el individuo productor--   como
dependiente  y  formando parte de un todo mayor  .....     Solamente al
llegar el siglo XVIII, con la  _sociedad civil_ ,  las diferentes formas de
conexión social aparecen ante el individuo como un simple medio para lograr
sus fines privados, como una necesidad exterior.  Pero la epoca que genera
este punto de vista, esta idea del individuo aislado, es precisamente
aquella en la cual las relaciones sociales    (universales según este punto
de vista)  han llegado al más alto grado de desarrollo alcanzado hasta el
presente.   El hombre es, en el sentido más literal, un   _zoon politikon_
 no solamente un animal social, sino un animal que sólo puede
individualizarse en la sociedad.   La producción por parte de un individuo
aislado, fuera de la sociedad    ---hecho raro que bien puede ocurrir
cuando un civilizado, que potencialmente posee ya en sí las fuerzas de la
sociedad, se extravía accidentalmente en una comarca salvaje--    no es
menos absurda que la idea de un desarrollo del lenguaje sin individuos que
vivan  _juntos_  y hablen entre sí.     No hay que detenerse más tiempo en
esto.  Ni siquiera habría que rozar el punto si esta tontería, que tenía un
sentido y una razón entre los hombres del siglo XVIII, no hubiera sido
introducida seriamente en plena economía moderna por Bastiat, Carey,
Proudhon, etc." )  



2)  ... But Gramsci bestowed upon the concept
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

So, civil society should be bound, in the Marxian view,  to the social
infrastructure, what would rend the expression useless, a remnant of the
XVIII th century political thought  alongside other liberal
_Robinsonades_, as the  "invisible hand"  and the   
_laissez faire, laissez aller, laissez passer, le monde va de soi même_.


Nevertheless, Antonio Gramsci related it to the superstructure too, without
ceasing to be a great Marxist thinker.   This is well explained
---believe it or not--   by a sympathetic liberal critic, the famous
Norberto Bobbio.   His little book   "Saggi su Gramsci"   (Essays on
Gramsci, Giangiacomo Feltrinelli Editore, Milan, 1990)  deals largely with
the subject. 



In solidarity, 
Roberto Magellan


Paix entre nous, guerre aux tyrans  ......
Ouvriers, paysans, nous sommes
Le grand PARTI DES TRAVAILLEURS.  

                ( L' Internationale )