ReOrient Discussion, AHA, Part II

ReOrient Discussion, AHA, Part II

ANDRE  GUNDAR FRANK,  Response:

	Gundar Frank's comments were on a more general-theoretical or 
meta-methodological plane  than were those of the previous speakers, and
I may not have seized them as well in my notes.  Perhaps he will fill in
for us in this forum. But some of his points were as follows:

	- Taking up Ringrose's admonition to go further in the analysis
of global connections, Frank noted another  AHA session on world history
in which one J. Bentley (?) spoke of the demographic and technological
factors that have shaped the course of the past MILLION years.... Bentley
also noted the connections  forged by migration, tradxe, conquest, and
disease; and Frank	would add: by the "black box" of the
macro-system itself.

	- As for European "advantages," these need to be seen
reflexively, as conditioned by extra-European factors and by the larger
system itself (e.g. the diffusion of mapmaking from the East)
	
	- Agrees with Lewis concerning "contingency" of the directions
taken by world history; agrees with Richards re bullion flows to India.  

	- Disagrees with Lewis about about the impact of science on
tools; argues no impact on technology  'til 1870s.

	- Applying the "reflexive" and "systemic" optics, Frank argues
that "predatory acquisitions," armed ships, the bullion trade, even the
development of Madrid  -- all occurred within and in response to
world-system parameters... all heavily influenced by China itself. Any
other approach, Frank warns, will land us in the Landes/Huntington
framework. and the fallacy of supposing "unique" and "independent"
factors at work. 

			***

QUESTIONS FROM THE FLOOR:

	I did not note most of these. One eloquent set of comments were
by a woman, author of "Sugar and Society in China." She also saw
significant 17th century shifts, led by Europe. She argued for the need
to disaggregate regions and oceans and markets; different things were
happening in different places at different times.  Particular social
relations (e.g. in London vs. Poland) were key to changes, first evolving
locally. Frank seemed especially dismissive of all this. There was no
great 17th century shift, he argued, and any growth then stimulated Asian
growth even more. 

	I wonder if AGF or anyone has further information on two other
matters that came up from the floor:  (a) mention of a book (?) by
Stedman Noble (?) on Egypt; 
(b) the  heated reference to the early South Pacific (?) mariners from
whom Europe allegedly borrowed its navigational techniques.  

			***

POLITICS AND PROSE

	I only came in at the tail end of  A. Gundar Frank's responses to
the audience here (a high-quality independent bookshop in D.C.), where a
book-signing and confab was also organized around ReOrient. I think my
friend Mary Coker will supply WSN with more details.  

	I did hear Frank once again dismiss Marx (to the dismay of the
assembled progressistes) and his claim that "capitalism" os a useless
category and does not exist.    
	On the "Asian meltdown," Frank made the following interesting
remarks: that the crisis was a normal and temporary crisis of
overproduction, and less a sign of weakness than of strength. For several
centuries now, it has been European recessions that have rocked the rest
of the world; now Asia is showing its clout again. Additionally,
effective countermeasures will probably be taken here. (In contrast, look
at E. Europe, Latin America, Africa,  which have all lost power and
initiative. 

	The Dollar, Frank said, is now being challenged (perhaps in
response to a question about  American hegemony). As long as the dollar
is a reserve currency, the Americans can simply keep printing money and
importing goods (while the Russian economy is running on US dollar
bills). A world view helps one see these things....

			***

KPM:

	And my own views on all this?  Anon!

	But let me throw out a hint. Let our reflexive mode apply to
social science (and world-system theory) itself. In which case we may be
permitted to opine  that Weber and Marx, like the Middle Kingdom and the
Moguls, remain central in the lon ger term.

			Best wishes to all --   K.


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