*** Cleland on 9/11 Commission ***

FYI:

http://www.pbs.org/now/transcript/transcript_cleland.html

With me today is one of the members of the 9/11 Commission, former
Georgia Senator, Max Cleland. His background gives him a unique
perspective. As a young man, he enlisted in the Army and served in
Vietnam, where he was seriously injured by a hand grenade.

Recovering from those wounds, Cleland committed himself to politics and
public service. He started as a Democratic member of the Georgia State
Senate. At the age of 34, President Jimmy Carter turned to Cleland to run
the Veterans Administration. Cleland was elected to the U.S. Senate in
1996, establishing his expertise not only in veterans and health issues,
but in bio-terrorism and homeland security.

He lost a bitter battle for reelection last year, and now teaches at
Washington's American University in addition to serving on the 9/11
Commission. Welcome to NOW. 
<snip>
SESNO: So, your commission builds on the joint
Congressional&

CLELAND: Yep. 

SESNO:&inquiry. 

CLELAND: Now, let's talk about that. 

SESNO: So, where do you go that they didn't? 

CLELAND: Let's talk about that here. This commission was formed
about mid-December, the 9/11 Commission. We were supposed to use the
joint inquiry report as a launching pad to get into this issue of not
only fixing the intelligence community, but moving beyond, and getting
into what is the al Qaeda all about? What is this terrorist global
network that we're fighting? A new kind of war and all that. 

Well, the independent, bi-partisan commission, hello, didn't even get the
stuff 'til a few weeks ago. 

I'm saying that's deliberate. I am saying that the delay in relating this
information to the American public out of a hearing& series of
hearings, that several members of Congress knew eight or ten months ago,
including Bob Graham and others, that was deliberately slow walked&
the 9/11 Commission was deliberately slow walked, because the
Administration's policy was, and its priority was, we're gonna take
Saddam Hussein out. 

SESNO: Senator, do you have any documentation or any proof to back
up this very serious charge of yours that this was deliberate besides
your own&

CLELAND: Well, first of all&

SESNO: &hunch or gut? 

CLELAND: &it's obvious. 

SESNO: No, no, no, no&

CLELAND: But& but&

SESNO: &but beyond& but beyond being obvious, let me
press&

CLELAND: First of all the war in Iraq&

SESNO: &you on this&

CLELAND: Yeah, okay. 

SESNO: &because this is a very serious charge you're making.
If you're saying that this was deliberate what I'm asking is has anybody
said anything to you, from inside the Administration to support that?
Have you seen any document, any memorandum that substantiates your
charge? 

CLELAND: Well, just look at it. Okay? This executive summary of
the intelligence inquiry& the joint intelligence inquiry, the
executive summary, was available December 10th. Why did it take nine
months to go over what ought to be held out of that? 

Now, I'm saying that that was slow walked. I am also saying why did it
take eight months to get this 9/11 Commission really cranked up and
going, and the first step was to use the Intelligence Committee report as
a jumping off point? Why did all of this take so long? 

Because the real priority of the White House was not the 9/11 Commission
they fought it. And it was just, and it really was their interest was to
delay the revelation of this report. 

One of the reasons they didn't want it is they didn't want all this stuff
out there. 

SESNO: The White House says, and I've spoken to them, that they
didn't slow walk it, that there was a lot of very sensitive information
involved, both in disseminating the information to begin with, and then
determining how much should be released. 

At the news conference where the report was discussed, Congressman Porter
Goss, who's head of the House Intelligence Committee, had the following
to say on the subject of the sensitivity of this information. Take a
look. 

[VIDEO EXCERPT]
PORTER GOSS: You also have to understand that there are people who
are watching this press conference who are going to read this book, who
are going to analyze what information we have put out, and what we
haven't put out. And the last thing we want to do in any way is create an
opportunity for a terrorist to take advantage of us because of something
we put in.
[END EXCERPT]

SESNO: Does he not have a point? That not just friends of the
American public, but America's enemies are reading these reports and
watching all of this? 

CLELAND: America's enemies have been& have declared war on
this country. But who declared war on the country? It was Osama bin
Laden, and his terrorist cadre. And Islamic fanatics. That's what 9/11
was all about. It was not about Saddam Hussein. Who has the worst or, the
greatest& who is the greatest threat in the world today to us, in
terms of weapons of mass destruction? It's not Saddam Hussein. It's North
Korea. So, why are we making this big deal? We should've found Osama bin
Laden. We should've destroyed his network around the world. That was
gonna take time. 

It wasn't gonna make headlines. You can't do that war in three weeks, and
say "Major combat's over." 

What you're really up against here is Islamic fundamental terrorism that
is infiltrating now not only back into Afghanistan, but into Iraq as
well. 

And that's what we're really up against. That's what the 9/11 Commission
was designed to explore. And we're just getting into that. 

SESNO: So what, specifically, are the key questions in your view
that the 9/11 Commission has to ask and answer by next May? 

CLELAND: Step number one, where in the world is Osama bin Laden?

SESNO: Well, how are you gonna answer&

CLELAND: Step num&

SESNO: &ask that? 

CLELAND: Step number two, what is the al Qaeda? Why did they do
this? Why did they shift their target from the monarchy in Saudi Arabia,
and the leadership in Egypt, why did they shift their target to America?
They shifted their target, we know that. 

And years ago, Osama bin Laden declared open war on the United States,
why? Because we support the monarchy in Saudi Arabia, we support the
leadership in Egypt. And that tees off a whole lot of folks out there.

SESNO: Step number three. FINANCIAL TIMES today reporting on the
Congressional report. Report raises new questions on Saudi role in 9/11
attacks. 

CLELAND: Absolutely. 

SESNO: How far into that will your commission, A, be able to go,
and B, actually be able to share with the public? 

CLELAND: All right. We're& first thing, if it walks like a
duck, looks like a duck, talks like a duck, it's a duck. 

You can read between the lines and see that there were foreign
governments that were much more involved in the 9/11 attack than just
supporting Islamic fundamentalist teachings and schools. Now, that has
been redacted. A whole 28 page section. 

SESNO: And will you have access to all the documentation,
including the redacted portion&

CLELAND: We darn well better. 

SESNO:&of those committee reports? 

CLELAND: Because& but look at what's happening. The
Administration, the White House, has put several blocks in the road. One,
they run all the information to the 9/11 Commission through a political
coordinator in Ashcroft's Justice Department. Duh. Why that? 

Secondly, they want to put minders that's people who sit in the room when
we have an interview with people in NSA, FBI, CIA, Department of& in
DIA in the Pentagon, and Immigration and Naturalization Services. They
want to put minders in there. That to shut down information. That's not
to reveal information. 

SESNO: On the connection, if there is one, between the Saudi
government and any funding or support for the 9/11 terrorists. Will you
have access to the information that was redacted? Have you already had
access to that? 

CLELAND: We got it now. 

SESNO: And how much&

CLELAND: It's& but we've got it late&

SESNO: And how much of what you&

CLELAND: We got it eight months late. 

SESNO: But how of what you find and pursue in addition to that
will your commission make public, and be able to make public? 

CLELAND: I hope all of it. 

SESNO: But you have no assurance of that. 

CLELAND: America& well, we better. 

SESNO: You are clearly passionate and exercised about this, and
you have compared Iraq to Vietnam. 

CLELAND: Absolutely. 

SESNO: You have used the q-word, "quagmire." 

CLELAND: It is a quagmire. 

SESNO: Why? Why? 

CLELAND: Because. There's so many similarities here. You have an
assessment, which even Wolfowicz now realizes we underestimated the
enemy. That was Dean Rusk's view a few years into Vietnam. 

You get the big land force in there. You know. You don't cure the
problem. And you're exposed. And then the guerrilla warfare comes after
you. That's Vietnam. That's the quagmire we're in in Iraq. There is no
exit strategy. Why? Because we want to do a pre-emptive war. We want to
do it all alone. 

SESNO: The administration would say the exit strategy is to build
a fledgling democracy in Iraq&

CLELAND: Lots of luck. 

SESNO: That then&

CLELAND: They're fighting 5000 years. 

SESNO:&provides& that provides a beacon for the region. 

CLELAND: Lots of luck. I mean, more power to `em. You can't force
or impose democracy with 150,000 troops. We tried to do it in South
Vietnam. There was an election there, and all this kind of stuff. But it
never worked. 

SESNO: I want to ask you about one final thing here, and that is
the Commission itself, which is supposed to be independent. And your take
on Iraq. You had a bruising, bitter political contest. Is this sour
grapes for you? 

CLELAND: No. No. I tell you what makes me mad. Is when I see the
names of those youngsters that are being killed out there every day. I
say, "God help us." I've been there. I've seen this movie
before. 

It was 35 years ago. I was one of those young 21-year-old, 22,
23-year-old guys. Young Lieutenant, hard charger, volunteer. First Air
Cavalry Division. Airborne, all this kind of stuff. Hoo-wah, hoo-wah,
hoo-wah. 

And we got great young soldiers. And I've been at Bethesda and Walter
Reade, and I've seen their legs blown off. And I've seen their eyes gone.
And that's what bothers me. 

SESNO: Very briefly, then, what do you think should be done now?

CLELAND: First of all, you got to go back and get the UN in there.
we've got to go back to the very people we dissed. And we got to say to
Russia and Germany and France and the UN and the Security Council,
"We're in deep trouble. Help us out." 

We got to make a UN protectorate, and that's gonna take a long time.

SESNO: Max Cleland. Thanks. 

CLELAND: Thank you. 

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