Re: Fwd: A Must Read: Brillinat article on the Indian situation by

Dear Trich,

Thank you for your detailed and excellent response. I realise this issue
is very close to your heart - which has rightly made you angry - but
your compassionate humanity and honest outrage are obvious to me. I look
forward to your future analyses and I sincerely hope that your
countrymen will not give you reason to post any denunciations of pogroms
again.   

Kind regards

Jonathan



-----Original Message-----
From: Trich Ganesh [mailto:TGanesh@southampton.liu.edu] 
Sent: 26 March 2002 20:09
To: Jonathan Davis
Cc: wsn@csf.colorado.edu
Subject: Re: Fwd: A Must Read: Brillinat article on the Indian situation
by


Dear Jonathan, 

I am a little wary of being dragged into a space where I often find it 
hard to retain my 'cool'.  I understand your questions are well-
intentioned.  So are some of the ones that I raise below. 

Is it not the state that supplies identities to its 'citizens'?  Am I 
correct in assuming that there is no 'state' without its complement 
of 'citizens', and that there are no 'citizens' who do not belong to a 
'state'?    Are not all identities socially constructed through and 
through, and if so how do they appear so "natural"? What is at 
stake in making it appear as if citizenship were the most 'natural' 
thing in the world, as well as the most contested?  And are our 
times remarkably different in this respect from past epochs?  I have 
read so much now by so many different scholars about the growing 
obsolescence of the nation-state.  And yet at the very moment 
when Hegel's owl of Minerva seems to have flown over the nation- state
(as the historian Hobsbawm concludes), there is such a 
resurgence of nationality, nationlism, ethnic violence, pogroms and 
mass slaughters.  How now?  Is there perhaps some other deeper 
logic at work producing both the paradox and the horrors of the 
paradox?  

Why do the identities bestowed upon us have to determine our 
knowlege of ourselves, and our potential to be?  Is it only through 
my identity as a Hindu or an Indian that you re-cognize who I am?  
Is there really an essential Hindu, an essential Muslim, and an 
essential Christian?  Or an essential Jew?   Who is the one who 
seeks to hold on to these identities?  What is it that is 'valorized' in

holding on to these identities?  And who is the one who supplies 
the value to these identities?  How do these values get produced 
and reproduced?  

Until these questions are sorted out in crystal clear manner, the 
implications of assuming an identity, for me,  will never be clear.  
All I know when I hear rabid Hindus cry "Hindutva" (an essential 
Hindu-ness) and commit pogroms, is that I am not "their" Hindu.  I 
refuse to be represented by them and I refuse to be silent in 
acknowledging that what they do is right.  And I am reminded 
tantalizingly, of the powerful enigma locked in Agamben's cryptic 
assertion that 'a man without a representable identity would be of 
no use to the state'. 

At the risk of not appearing to answer your question directly, I am 
reminded as well, of the novelist Golding's lines that in the 
twentieth century - and I would say in the twenty first as well - "it 
has become commonplace for a random selection of people to 
inflict utter cruelty upon one another".  If we go further back in world

history, the 20th century may not appear that unique at all.  As 
Benjamin declares, 'there is no document of civilization that is not 
also a document of its barbarism': in short, civilization always had 
barbarism as its necessary complement.  That does not however 
imply that it will always be so or that it should always be so.  It is 
not by slaughtering my neighborers that I am redressed for the 
wrong done by people who look like him or believe like him or talk 
like him.  No religion that I am aware of ever says so - not the Gita, 
not the Koran, not the Bible, not the Old Testament (let alone the 
Mishnah or the Talmud), not the Granth Sahib, not the Zend 
Avesta.  Any one who claims to be religious and draws inspiration 
from any of these texts and yet allows himself to slip into terrible 
savagery (of the kind that you and I are talking about) or to 
condone it, Jonathan, has fallen from high places!

Be well.  TKGanesh.


From:                   "Jonathan Davis" <jonathan.davis@lineone.net>
To:                     "Trich Ganesh" <TGanesh@southampton.liu.edu>,
<wwagar@binghamton.edu>
Copies to:              <wsn@csf.colorado.edu>
Subject:                Re: Fwd: A Must Read: Brillinat article on the
Indian situation by
Date sent:              Tue, 26 Mar 2002 18:49:35 -0000

> Dear Mr Ganesh,
> 
> You say you were born a Hindu but what are you now? Your apparent 
> (self) hatred of Hindus makes me wonder.
> 
> Might I suggest you read some of Horowitz's works on Deadly Ethnic 
> Riots. It might calm you down and help you see both sides of this 
> complex issue. Your words come across as fairly rabid Anti-Hindu 
> propaganda and as such does not help clarify the issues.
> 
> By the way, what are your feelings on the massacre that led to these 
> ethnic riots? Do I need to remind you of what I am talking about? It 
> was the one where Muslim death dealers and life-haters burned to death

> a train coach load of innocent Hindu men, women and children...
> 
> Regards
> 
> Jonathan
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Trich Ganesh" <TGanesh@southampton.liu.edu>
> To: <wwagar@binghamton.edu>
> Cc: <wsn@csf.colorado.edu>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 26, 2002 2:12 PM
> Subject: Re: Fwd: A Must Read: Brillinat article on the Indian 
> situation by
> 
> 
> > I thank you, Dr. Wagar, for your sympathetic words.  I wish an 
> > increasing concentration on, and systematic denunciation of, these 
> > recurrent pogroms could turn once and for all the tide against these

> > bullies, cowards, and fanatics...  If there is one moment when I am 
> > tempted to agree wholeheartedly with Procyet regarding the grenade 
> > or the gun, it is surely against these Hindu death-dealers and 
> > life-haters, these shameless hypocrites.  I know that there are many

> > who refuse to accept the bizzare view of life and people that these 
> > new Hindus are propagating.  They have little legitimacy other than 
> > through the use of force and violence - but which is also decisive 
> > since as Marx remarks, between two rights it is always might that 
> > decides -  which in fact goes against everything great and noble 
> > about the figure of the Mahatma (about whom Einstein once remarked 
> > that generations to come will scarce believe that a man like this 
> > walked the face of the earth).  Now what a terrible shame shadows 
> > the huge subcontinent, home to some of the greatest intellectuals, 
> > some of the greatest poets and thinkers and visionaries the world 
> > has ever known.  What an appalling stigma! - 'all the perfumes of 
> > Arabia', all the hymns of the Vedas,  will not be able to cleanse 
> > the stinking, filthy odor of these Hindu fundamentalists, these 
> > wretched lackeys of foreign capital, these miserable cowards who 
> > feel strong by making war on women, children and helpless 
> > minorities.
> >
> > Now more than ever is it necessary to denounce these brazen actions 
> > for what they are.  Now more than ever, is it necessary to draw 
> > strength from the world traditions of the oppressed to denounce 
> > these multiple atrocities being committed in the name of the 
> > 'people'.
> >
> > I recall the chain of representation that Hardt and Negri draw our 
> > attention to: the 'state' represents the 'nation', the nation 
> > represents the 'people', and the people represents the 'multitudes'.

> > How does one labor to break once and for all these vicious links in 
> > the chain of representations?  Tired and delirious no doubt, 
> > TKGanesh.
> >
> > Date sent:      Tue, 26 Mar 2002 00:04:54 -0500 (EST)
> > From:           wwagar@binghamton.edu
> > To:             Trich Ganesh <TGanesh@southampton.liu.edu>
> > Copies to:      saimaa@lums.edu.pk, <wsn@csf.colorado.edu>
> > Subject:        Re: Fwd: A Must Read: Brillinat article on the
Indian
> situation by
> >
> > >
> > > Trich Ganesh, thank you for those heartfelt words.  I am ashamed 
> > > to have been born an "Onwards Christian Soldier."  The widespread
> perversion
> > > of religion by tribalist fanatics in our time, and many other 
> > > times, leaves me desolated.  None of the other antisystemic forces

> > > at work
> today
> > > begins to rival the power wielded by these nightmarish "holy" 
> > > fools.
> All
> > > things considered, I know that capitalist globalization is much, 
> > > much worse, but sometimes my faith is shaken.  Reading your 
> > > comments, and the terrifying article by Harsh Mander, has led me 
> > > to one of those times.
> > >
> > > Warren
> > >
> > > W. Warren Wagar
> > > Department of History
> > > Binghamton University, SUNY
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, 25 Mar 2002, Trich Ganesh wrote:
> > >
> > > > I have thought and felt the same too: the land called India is 
> > > > almost beyond all recognition.  India is becoming the despair of

> > > > its children.  Part of the problem is the money for these 
> > > > operations, which I think are financed in no small part by 
> > > > non-resident Hindus who work and live abroad, and who regularly 
> > > > send money to fund the pogrom-ers.  It is an everlasting shame, 
> > > > and it cuts me to the quick, and it makes be horribly ashamed of

> > > > being born a Hindu. Issac Deutscher once wrote a book called 
> > > > "The Non-Jewish Jew", where he identifies Marx, Spinoza, 
> > > > Trotsky, among others, as non- Jewish Jews.  Is it not time for 
> > > > all Hindus everywhere, who have the least amount of self-respect

> > > > and who wish to be contradiction-free (as if that were 
> > > > possible!) to declare their allegiance against all these 
> > > > rotten-to-the core-Hindus, who are the most shameless, most 
> > > > atrocious, most hateful of all the nether-forces that stalk 
> > > > today a periphery subject to the unevenly exploitative 
> > > > domination of US capital?
> > > >
> > > > I thank you again for bringing this article to my attention.  
> > > > TKG.
> > > >
> > > > Date sent:      Mon, 25 Mar 2002 13:15:00 +0500 (PKT)
> > > > Subject:        Fwd: A Must Read: Brillinat article on the
Indian
> situation by an Indian IAS OfficeR!
> > > > From:           "Saima Alvi" <saimaa@lums.edu.pk>
> > > > To:             wsn@csf.colorado.edu
> > > > Copies to:      bsc2001@yahoogroups.com
> > > > Send reply to:  saimaa@lums.edu.pk
> > > >
> > > > > Posted from www.ncasindia.org
> > > > >
> > > > > (a website of National Centre for Advocacy Studies located at
> Serenity
> > > > > Complex, Ramnagar Colony, Pashan, Pune 411 021, India. Tel.: 
> > > > > 91+020-
> > > > > 2952003/4)
> > > > >
> > > > > p.s. in case u dont want to read the entire article, then read

> > > > > from
> fifth
> > > > > para onwards.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > CRY, THE BELOVED COUNTRY
> > > > > ========================
> > > > > Reflections on the Gujarat massacre
> > > > >
> > > > > By Harsh Mander
> > > > >
> > > > > (The writer, is a serving IAS Officer, who is working on 
> > > > > deputation
> with a
> > > > > development organisation)
> > > > >
> > > > > Numbed with disgust and horror, I return from Gujarat ten days

> > > > > after
> the
> > > > > terror and massacre that convulsed the state. My heart is 
> > > > > sickened,
> my
> > > > > soul wearied, my shoulders aching with the burdens of guilt 
> > > > > and
> shame. As
> > > > > you walk through the camps of riot survivors in Ahmedabad, in 
> > > > > which
> an
> > > > > estimated 53,000 women, men, and children are huddled in 29
> temporary
> > > > > settlements, displays of overt grief are unusual. People 
> > > > > clutch
> small
> > > > > bundles of relief materials, all that they now own in the 
> > > > > world,
> with dry
> > > > > and glassy eyes. Some talk in low voices, others busy 
> > > > > themselves
> with the
> > > > > tasks of everyday living in these most basic of shelters, 
> > > > > looking
> for
> > > > > food and milk for children, tending the wounds of the injured.

> > > > > But
> once
> > > > > you sit anywhere in these camps, people begin to speak and 
> > > > > their
> words
> > > > > are like masses of pus released by slitting large festering 
> > > > > wounds.
> The
> > > > > horrors that they speak of are so macabre, that my pen falters

> > > > > in
> the
> > > > > writing. The pitiless brutality against women and small 
> > > > > children by organised bands of armed young men is more savage 
> > > > > than anything
> witnessed
> > > > > in the riots that have shamed this nation from time to time 
> > > > > during
> the
> > > > > past century.
> > > > >
> > > > > I force myself to write a small fraction of all that I heard 
> > > > > and
> saw,
> > > > > because it is important that we all know. Or maybe also 
> > > > > because I
> need to
> > > > > share my own burdens.
> > > > >
> > > > > What can you say about a woman eight months pregnant who 
> > > > > begged to
> be
> > > > > spared? Her assailants instead slit open her stomach, pulled 
> > > > > out her foetus and slaughtered it before her eyes. What can 
> > > > > you say about a family of nineteen being killed by flooding 
> > > > > their house with water
> and
> > > > > then electrocuting them with high-tension electricity?
> > > > >
> > > > > What can you say? A small boy of six in Juhapara camp 
> > > > > described how
> his
> > > > > mother and six brothers and sisters were battered to death 
> > > > > before
> his
> > > > > eyes. He survived only because he fell unconscious, and was 
> > > > > taken
> for
> > > > > dead. A family escaping from Naroda-Patiya, one of the 
> > > > > worst-hit settlements in Ahmedabad, spoke of losing a young 
> > > > > woman and her
> three
> > > > > month old son, because a police constable directed her to 
> > > > > `safety'
> and
> > > > > she found herself instead surrounded by a mob which doused her

> > > > > with kerosene and set her and her baby on fire. I have never 
> > > > > known a riot which has used the sexual subjugation of women so

> > > > > widely as an
> instrument
> > > > > of violence in the recent mass barbarity in Gujarat. There are
> reports
> > > > > every where of gang-rape, of young girls and women, often in 
> > > > > the
> presence
> > > > > of members of their families, followed by their murder by 
> > > > > burning
> alive,
> > > > > or by bludgeoning with a hammer and in one case with a screw 
> > > > > driver. Women in the Aman Chowk shelter told appalling stories

> > > > > about how
> armed
> > > > > men disrobed themselves in front of a group of terrified women

> > > > > to
> cower
> > > > > them down further.
> > > > >
> > > > > In Ahmedabad, most people I met - social workers,journalists,
> survivors -
> > > > > agree that what Gujarat witnessed was not a riot, but a 
> > > > > terrorist
> attack
> > > > > followed by a systematic, planned massacre, a pogrom. Everyone

> > > > > spoke
> of the
> > > > > pillage and plunder, being organised like a military operation
> against an
> > > > > external armed enemy. An initial truck would arrive 
> > > > > broadcasting inflammatory slogans, soon followed by more 
> > > > > trucks which disgorged
> young
> > > > > men, mostly in khaki shorts and saffron sashes. They were 
> > > > > armed with sophisticated explosive materials, country weapons,

> > > > > daggers and
> trishuls.
> > > > > They also carried water bottles, to sustain them in their 
> > > > > exertions.
> The
> > > > > leaders were seen communicating on mobile telephones from the 
> > > > > riot
> venues,
> > > > > receiving instructions from and reporting back to a 
> > > > > co-ordinating
> centre.
> > > > > Some were seen with documents and computer sheets listing 
> > > > > Muslim
> families
> > > > > and their properties. They had detailed precise knowledge 
> > > > > about
> buildings
> > > > > and businesses held by members of the minority community, such

> > > > > as
> who were
> > > > > partners say in a restaurant business, or which Muslim homes 
> > > > > had
> Hindu
> > > > > spouses who should be spared in the violence.
> > > > >
> > > > > This was not a spontaneous upsurge of mass anger. It was a 
> > > > > carefully planned pogrom.
> > > > >
> > > > > The trucks carried quantities of gas cylinders. Rich Muslim 
> > > > > homes
> and
> > > > > business establishments were first systematically looted, 
> > > > > stripped
> down
> > > > > of all their valuables, then cooking gas was released from 
> > > > > cylinders
> into
> > > > > the buildings for several minutes. A trained member of the 
> > > > > group
> then lit
> > > > > the flame which efficiently engulfed the building. In some 
> > > > > cases, acetylene gas which is used for welding steel, was 
> > > > > employed to
> explode
> > > > > large concrete buildings. Mosques and dargahs were razed, and 
> > > > > were replaced by statues of Hanuman and saffron flags. Some 
> > > > > dargahs in Ahmedabad city crossings have overnight been 
> > > > > demolished and their
> sites
> > > > > covered with road building material, and bulldozed so 
> > > > > efficiently
> that
> > > > > these spots are
> > > > > indistinguishable from the rest of the road. Traffic now plies

> > > > > over
> these
> > > > > former dargahs, as though they never existed.
> > > > >
> > > > > The unconscionable failures and active connivance of the state
> police and
> > > > > administrative machinery is also now widely acknowledged. The 
> > > > > police
> is
> > > > > known to have misguided people straight into the hands of 
> > > > > rioting
> mobs.
> > > > > They provided protective shields to crowds bent on pillage, 
> > > > > arson,
> rape
> > > > > and murder, and were deaf to the pleas of the desperate Muslim
> victims,
> > > > > many of them women and children. There have been many reports 
> > > > > of
> police
> > > > > firing directly mostly at the minority community, which was 
> > > > > the
> target of
> > > > > most of the mob violence. The large majority of arrests are 
> > > > > also
> from the
> > > > > same community which was the main victim of the pogrom.
> > > > >
> > > > > As one who has served in the Indian Administrative Service for

> > > > > over
> two
> > > > > decades, I feel great shame at the abdication of duty of my 
> > > > > peers in
> the
> > > > > civil and police administration. The law did not require any 
> > > > > of them
> to
> > > > > await orders from their political supervisors before they 
> > > > > organised
> the
> > > > > decisive use of force to prevent the brutal escalation of 
> > > > > violence,
> and
> > > > > to protect vulnerable women and children from the organised,
> murderous
> > > > > mobs. The law instead required them to act independently,
> fearlessly,
> > > > > impartially, decisively, with courage and compassion. If even 
> > > > > one official had so acted in Ahmedabad, she or he could have 
> > > > > deployed
> the
> > > > > police forces and called in the army to halt the violence and
> protect the
> > > > > people in a matter of hours. No riot can continue beyond a few

> > > > > hours without the active connivance of the local police and 
> > > > > magistracy.
> The
> > > > > blood of hundreds of innocents is on the hands of the police 
> > > > > and
> civil
> > > > > authorities of Gujarat, and by sharing in a conspiracy of 
> > > > > silence,
> on the
> > > > > entire higher bureaucracy of the country. I have heard senior
> officials
> > > > > blame also the communalism of the police constabulary for 
> > > > > their connivance in the violence. This too is a thin and 
> > > > > disgraceful
> alibi. The
> > > > > same forces have been known to act with impartiality and 
> > > > > courage
> when led
> > > > > by officers of professionalism and integrity. The failure is 
> > > > > clearly
> of
> > > > > the leadership of the police and civil services, not of the
> subordinate
> > > > > men and women in khaki who are trained to obey their orders.
> > > > >
> > > > > Where also, amidst this savagery, injustice, and human 
> > > > > suffering is
> the
> > > > > `civil society', the Gandhians, the development workers, the 
> > > > > NGOs,
> the
> > > > > fabled spontaneous Gujarathi philanthropy which was so much in
> evidence
> > > > > in the earthquake in Kutch and Ahmedabad? The newspapers 
> > > > > reported
> that at
> > > > > the peak of the pogrom, the gates of Sabarmati Asram were 
> > > > > closed to protect its properties, it should instead have been 
> > > > > the city's major sanctuary. Which Gandhian leaders, or NGO 
> > > > > managers, staked their
> lives to
> > > > > halt the death-dealing throngs? It is one more shame that we 
> > > > > as
> citizens of
> > > > > this country must carry on our already burdened backs, that 
> > > > > the
> camps for
> > > > > the Muslim riot victims in Ahmedabad are being run almost
> exclusively by
> > > > > Muslim organisations. It is as though the monumental pain, 
> > > > > loss,
> betrayal
> > > > > and injustice suffered by the Muslim people is the concern 
> > > > > only of
> other
> > > > > Muslim people, and the rest of us have no share in the
> responsibility to
> > > > > assuage, to heal and rebuild. The state, which bears the 
> > > > > primary responsibility to extend both protection and relief to

> > > > > its
> vulnerable
> > > > > citizens, was nowhere in evidence in any of the camps, to 
> > > > > manage, organise the security, or even to provide the 
> > > > > resources that are
> required
> > > > > to feed the tens of thousands of defenceless women, men and 
> > > > > children huddled in these camps for safety.
> > > > >
> > > > > The only passing moments of pride and hope that I experienced 
> > > > > in
> Gujarat,
> > > > > were when I saw men like Mujid Ahmed and women like Roshan 
> > > > > Bahen who served in these camps with tireless, dogged humanism

> > > > > amidst the
> ruins
> > > > > around them. In the Aman Chowk camp, women blessed the young 
> > > > > band of volunteers who worked from four in the morning until 
> > > > > after midnight
> to
> > > > > ensure that none of their children went without food or milk, 
> > > > > or
> that
> > > > > their wounds remained untended. Their leader Mujid Ahmed is a
> graduate,
> > > > > his small chemical dyes factory has been burnt down, but he 
> > > > > has had
> no
> > > > > time to worry about his own loss. Each day he has to find 1600
> kilograms
> > > > > of foodgrain to feed some 5000 people who have taken shelter 
> > > > > in the
> camp.
> > > > > The challenge is even greater for Roshan Bahen, almost 60, who

> > > > > wipes
> her
> > > > > eyes each time she hears the stories of horror by the 
> > > > > residents in Juapara camp. But she too has no time for the 
> > > > > luxuries of grief or
> anger.
> > > > > She barely sleeps, as her volunteers, mainly working class 
> > > > > Muslim
> women
> > > > > and men from the humble tenements around the camp, provide 
> > > > > temporary toilets, food and solace to the hundreds who have 
> > > > > gathered in the
> grounds
> > > > > of a primary school to escape the ferocity of merciless mobs.
> > > > >
> > > > > As I walked through the camps, I wondered what Gandhiji would 
> > > > > have
> done
> > > > > in these dark hours. I recall the story of the Calcutta riots,

> > > > > when Gandhi was fasting for peace. A Hindu man came to him, to

> > > > > speak of
> his
> > > > > young boy who had been killed by Muslim mobs, and of the depth

> > > > > of
> his
> > > > > anger and longing for revenge. And Gandhi is said to have 
> > > > > replied:
> If you
> > > > > really wish to overcome your pain, find a young boy, just as 
> > > > > young
> as
> > > > > your son, a Muslim boy whose parents have been killed by Hindu

> > > > > mobs. Bring up that boy like you would your own son, but bring

> > > > > him up with
> the
> > > > > Muslim faith to which he was born. Only then will you find 
> > > > > that you
> can
> > > > > heal your pain, your anger, and your longing for retribution.
> > > > >
> > > > > There are no voices like Gandhi's that we hear today. Only
> discourses on
> > > > > Newtonian physics, to justify vengeance on innocents. We need 
> > > > > to
> find
> > > > > these voices within our own hearts, we need to believe enough 
> > > > > in
> justice,
> > > > > love, tolerance. There is much that the murdering mobs in 
> > > > > Gujarat
> have
> > > > > robbed from me. One of them is a song I often sang with pride 
> > > > > and conviction. The words of the song are:
> > > > >
> > > > > Sare jahan se achha Hindustan hamara. It is a song I will 
> > > > > never be
> able
> > > > > to sing again.
> > > > >
> > > > > --
> > > > > Saima Alvi
> > > > > Research Assistant
> > > > > Lahore University of Management Sciences (LUMS) Opposite 
> > > > > Sector U, DHA, Lahore-54792
> > > > > Tel.: 5722670-79; Ext.: 2165
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
>