Re: Fw: Annan blames Ethiopia...

I agree with Alan about the dangers of adopting glittering generalities
like "self-determination." Words like "democracy" and "freedom" face the
same problem, since capitalists use those words, too. Any claim of
self-determination has to be judged against the concrete situation. If
white supremacists in Idaho make a claim of self-determination (to
establish a white-only Christian state) then I think that both Alan and I
would not see this as a legitimate claim. But if Indian nations in North
America make a similar claim, and it is popularly supported, I would be
apt to join the struggle, even if there was no socialist revolution tied
to it. This is why I argue that nationalist movements have to be judged in
context. Just as we cannot accept every claim of self-determination, we
cannot condemn every nationalist struggle. I think it cuts both ways.

Andrew Austin

On Mon, 10 Apr 2000, Spectors wrote:

>What is "self-determination?"  Seriously.  Is it rule by capitalist rulers
>from your own ethnic group?  Is that a "step" towards total liberation?  I
>agree that the struggle against imperialist invaders/exploiters is part of
>the struggle against capitalism, and that people who abstain from that
>struggle in order to pretend to strive for a utopian dream in the future 
>are
>making a mistake. But that does not mean endorsing the specific slogan
>"self-determination."  It is an abstraction that opens the door to calling
>for Kosovar Albanian "self-determination" and supporting NATO bombing, for
>example (which, by the way, Andy Austin was a strong critic of that NATO
>bombing, so I'm not criticizing him.)
>
>But "self-determination" as a positive slogan? That's also what the TPLF
>(Tigrayan political leadership) in Ethiopia is using as an excuse to set up
>segregated regions.
>\
>Just some thoughts,
>
>Alan Spector
>
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Andrew Wayne Austin <aaustin@utkux.utcc.utk.edu>
>To: WORLD SYSTEMS NETWORK <wsn@csf.colorado.edu>
>Date: Monday, April 10, 2000 9:57 AM
>Subject: Re: Fw: Annan blames Ethiopia...
>
>
>>
>>There are at least two struggles that occur in capitalist colonial
>>situations. One is the struggle of the working classes to overthrow
>>capitalist rule and replace it with a democratic system. The other is to
>>overthrow colonial rule and achieve a measure of self-determination. The
>>Oromo people have the right not to be enslaved by external oppressors.
>>Would one suggest that African Americans should not have been emancipated
>>from slavery because they are now wage-laborers? To be sure, these
>>struggles are linked, just as they are linked with other struggles of age
>>and gender, but this is why the immediate struggle for self-determination
>>cannot be sacrificed to an ideal vision of the future - especially because
>>self-determinism is part of concretely achieving that vision.
>>
>>Andrew Austin
>>
>>
>>
>
>